An Advocate for Passionate Women

An Interview with Genevieve Kineke

(Genevieve Kineke is the founding editor of Canticle Magazine. She also hosts the new My Secret is Mine podcast, and runs a new apostolate for women of mature faith, called House of Gold - Domus Aurea. This interview took place in 2007.)

Kristen: Did you grow up Catholic?

Genevieve: I had a tricky childhood, nominally Protestant, but far from God. I yearned for something deeper. Christianity was a backdrop at home, a polite structure for vague piety and nice family meals. I’d go to Young Life meetings and doodle crosses on my jeans and stuff like that.

The Catholics were a low-class religion, and the Episcopalians were the elite. If you sided with the immigrants, there was a tacit assumption that you must not be using your brain. But, what drew me to the Church was the logic, the way that all the pieces fit together.

Kristen: And so you became a low-class Catholic? (laughs)

Genevieve: That was my rebellion. Some try cults or drugs, but I did the Catholic thing. I received all of my sacraments the year that I married, in 1984. I was a fanatic.

Kristen: What do you mean by fanatic?

Genevieve: There was the dress code, with a turtleneck at the chin and long skirt to the ankles, and the “uber-pious” gestures at Mass and prayer. I wanted to set myself apart as a sign of contradiction, but not in a healthy way. It was mostly self-righteous and narrow, lacking in charity. I probably put off more people than I drew by my intensity. It was not a holy intensity, it was a holocaust.

Kristen: What knocked you off your high horse?

Genevieve: Married life, children, life happens. As you are entrusted with these diverse souls, they bring you back to God’s will. You can be a sign of contradiction without standing out like a sore thumb. Then, in evangelising the children, one finds that they don’t always conform according to expectations. What a surprise! There are misunderstandings, and sometimes heartbreakingly bad choices.

Kristen: So, your life isn’t perfect?

Genevieve: A huge product of this culture is the Norman Rockwell backdrop. The Calvinist view is that if you are the elect, there will be a visual sign. If you are not “turned out” and functioning, then you feel as if you are doing something wrong. The most meaningful work I have done focused on women and forgiveness, finding God’s mercy in the dark corners of our lives.

Kristen: What do you say to women who have weathered a horrible storm in their lives?

Genevieve: Very gently, I ask, “What did you learn? You couldn’t possibly have not learned something – and in fact, God just entrusted you with a huge treasure. Can I see it too?” We should plumb those crises–they provide wisdom we could not learn any other way.

I love the story of the Velveteen rabbit. We’re real! We’ve walked through fire, and seen what grace has done. My trials have made me real. I can hold my head up with the people who suffer, because before, I only imagined that I understood.

Kristen: You don’t like being called a feminist. Why?

Genevieve: It’s such a loaded term. And yet, you know those women in the 1950s were mad about something. When I argue with feminists, I acknowledge all the bad things—the abuse, the sexist bias, the oppression. Agree with them as much as you possibly can, but stop short of wholesale acceptance of the sexual revolution, because it goes against our feminine dignity to allow our bodies to be used by men through contraception and abortion.

Kristen: So, it’s about sexuality?

Genevieve: Well, actually, it’s about mutual respect in all things. People seem unwilling to face the fact that human sexuality is not evil or dirty or something to be hidden, but sex still needs to be put on a pedestal and treated with due respect because it includes creativity and love. Unpacking the theology of the body of Pope John Paul II will take many decades to figure out.

Kristen: Someone dared to post on your blog that the Church objectifies women like Playboy. What was your response?

Genevieve: As if it needs to be explained! (laughs) The difference between Playboy and the Church is that the former is utilitarian. “Find a warm body and hump your brains out; lather, rinse, repeat.” That body is simply a means to your orgasm. The Church says that sex is marvelous, wondrous, holy and transcendent, so it has to be approached with reverence. The beauty of mutual love is that both know that their mutual gifts of self have been received with respect for the entire person.

Kristen: In your book, you exhort women to model the Church with their lives. How do we do this in the frenetic rush that most women endure between work and home?

Genevieve: Constancy, I pray for constancy, not to flag, not to waver, not to fall apart. Remember that each woman will provide heat and light in her own unique way, because the Church has many diverse qualities. While each woman must be an icon of the bride in love with Jesus, the path of her life will be as distinctive as her relationship with the Bridegroom. Think of the Sanctuary. Your constant maternal love is the lamp in front of the Tabernacle!